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ReggieK
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Joined: 16 Oct 2005
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 12:21 pm
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On here have not mentioned the latest offering on telly "On benefits and proud"
Me and Ben watched it earlier, and were cracking up at Julie and Vinny from Liverpool
I've seen them loads on Jeremy Kyle, Julie seems a bit strange with her violent temper and twitches, and poor Vinny is very much under the thumb.
Julie was angry that her daughter had got a job, and with good reason.
40 a day selling mobile phones is well under the minimum wage, and if her daughter moved out she wouldn't get full housing benefit or council tax benefit so there's absolutely no point working in that situation

It's all very well people bleating about it, but this government again has broken its promises.
They said before they were elected they'd make work pay.
All you get is 10 a week you discount above the JSA rate.
And every 1 you earn above the housing benefit threshold, they take 65p off you.

A very entertaining programme we felt, made more amusing from the foaming at the mouth vitriol spewed from the usual right wing rags Rolling Eyes
Steve50
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Joined: 13 Mar 2006
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 12:30 pm
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Some people also say that the only job they could get (minimum wage) is not worth the hassle when you can get benefits close to it.

Rent paid - 70pw
Tax - 20pw
Money in your pocket - 50pw
Dentist, doctors, opticians, all paid up.

Get a job, get paid what 70? more.


40 hour week, working for basically less than 2 per hour extra....No point, take the benefits, and live you life.

Of course a better paid job would be worth doing, but without taking a college course which most (on benefits) don't have the money for to learn the skills needed, then they will never get anywhere, without a bit of luck along the way.

So to the majority, good luck to them, IMO Smile
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ReggieK
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 12:58 pm
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Spot on Steve, absolutely

Brodders to turn up in 3..2...1 saying all doleites should be hung Mr. Green
Indestructible
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 1:09 pm
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This is the sort of show I start watching, but rather than throw a brick through the TV I turn it over. Mainly as it is hard working people like me that fund them. Twisted Evil
Steve50
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 1:20 pm
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Indestructible wrote:
This is the sort of show I start watching, but rather than throw a brick through the TV I turn it over. Mainly as it is hard working people like me that fund them. Twisted Evil


You are also making the world a better place by reducing crime by funding them. Cool
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stejens
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X
Quads


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 1:24 pm
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I think when political debate includes whether or not it is appropriate to pay a human being a living wage for working, something has gone seriously wrong with this country.

If you can't afford to pay somebody a living wage, you can't afford to employ them. Probably you'd rather run a shit business on the backs of other people's misery and have the opportunity to swan around thinking of yourself as some bad-ass business person rather than get a job... presumably because working for a living is beneath you, and possibly because a lot of jobs don't pay a living wage.

For the record, I took my first job at the local grocer / fishmonger when I was 14 working an hour before school and two hours afterwards... I've been in work ever since other than for a short period after being made redundant when I supported myself with my hard-earned redundancy package. I don't resent people living on benefits - the majority don't want to, most get very little, and a few idiots like Ben aren't going to break the bank - the bankers already did that.
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MFCMark00
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Joined: 22 Aug 2012
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 2:05 pm
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Steve50 wrote:
Some people also say that the only job they could get (minimum wage) is not worth the hassle when you can get benefits close to it.

Rent paid - 70pw
Tax - 20pw
Money in your pocket - 50pw
Dentist, doctors, opticians, all paid up.

Get a job, get paid what 70? more.


40 hour week, working for basically less than 2 per hour extra....No point, take the benefits, and live you life.

Of course a better paid job would be worth doing, but without taking a college course which most (on benefits) don't have the money for to learn the skills needed, then they will never get anywhere, without a bit of luck along the way.

So to the majority, good luck to them, IMO Smile



Pretty short sighted view.

Taking the entry level job isn't just about the money you make next week, it's about the career progression over the next x years.
Steve50
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 2:50 pm
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MFCMark00 wrote:
Steve50 wrote:
Some people also say that the only job they could get (minimum wage) is not worth the hassle when you can get benefits close to it.

Rent paid - 70pw
Tax - 20pw
Money in your pocket - 50pw
Dentist, doctors, opticians, all paid up.

Get a job, get paid what 70? more.


40 hour week, working for basically less than 2 per hour extra....No point, take the benefits, and live you life.

Of course a better paid job would be worth doing, but without taking a college course which most (on benefits) don't have the money for to learn the skills needed, then they will never get anywhere, without a bit of luck along the way.

So to the majority, good luck to them, IMO Smile



Pretty short sighted view.

Taking the entry level job isn't just about the money you make next week, it's about the career progression over the next x years.


Would make more progression sitting at home enjoying your dole and spending those 40 hours studying books.
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Brodders
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 4:34 pm
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The Welfare system is in place to provide help and support for anyone who has fallen on hard times and gives them financial and other means for trying to get back into employment (re-training etc.)

Why is it now considered a right to be given money for doing nothing ? The argument that seems to be used is that people are only marginally better off working than on the dole. In that case the benefits are too high and should be cut. You have to give people an incentive to work and it's not possible to control the wage market as competitive forces in the economy dictate the correct "price" of a particular job.

What this country has lost is proper blue collar type jobs. The loss of most of our manufacturing industries has led to a huge number of people who would previously have gone into this type of role being left with very few options. Nothing can be done about other countries manufacturing goods cheaply and we don't have the natural resources to have mining or oil/gas industries of the level required.

The enormous amount of immigration disgustingly brought in through the back door by Labour's social engineering has meant the labour market is flooded with blue collar workers prepared to work for a pittance because it's still significantly more than they were earning in their home countries. In London you can't find a non-Eastern European cleaner, builder, painter etc.

The other great debacle of the last 50 years has been the artificial increase in the number of University "graduates". It used to be that people went to school and the bright children were given opportunities to explore their intellectual potential through Grammar schools and then the brightest children went to University to gain a degree in something tangible and useful. Those children who weren't as bright would be given opportunities to go into an apprenticeship or gain a trade and would take pride in the job they did whatever it might be.

We now live in a Society of envy where people feel that they are entitled to things without earning them. I come across so many young people who want pay rises after 3 months in a job or you see people on benefits going on foreign holidays or playing Playstations through their large widescreen televisions.

I make no apology for expecting people to have personal pride and want to give rather than take. After I left school I was living on income support of 14 per week and getting 40 per week housing benefit. 50 a week went on my bedsit rent leaving me 4 to live on and I took a job at the bottom rung in order to work my way up. The likes of Ben aren't prepared to do that anymore and it makes me sick.

The only way to make this better is to find a way of creating industry again. The likes of China and India have reduced the costs of manufacturing to such a low level that it's impossible to compete and there will always be cheap labour available round the world. We don't need millions of young people with 2/2 degrees in business studies from Trent Poly and delusions of grandeur - we need young people who are prepared to work hard and find a trade or a job that enables them to develop to their greatest potential.

I have no idea what that industry will be but I suspect it will have to be in a specialised high tech field that can't be copied cheaply abroad.
ReggieK
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PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 5:09 pm
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Wow, sounded like a Hovis advert

What's needed is a living wage, and a proper cull of things like the K2 avoidance scheme.

It's ridiculous that people still have to live on benefits when they work full time.

As I've said before, Ben wants a job but not one where he's better off on JSA
qwerqwer
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Joined: 22 Nov 2007
Posts: 99

PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 6:49 pm
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1. Love
2. nothing else matters
3 repeat until fade
paddymick
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Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 3455
Location: Leicester

PostPosted: Sat Nov 16, 2013 8:17 pm
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Brodders wrote:

Why is it now considered a right to be given money for doing nothing ?


Unfortunately it's been the case for a long time, since money came into widespread use in fact, and the first loan was given that required the payment of interest.
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