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lancs69
One Pair
Joined: 07 Apr 2010
Posts: 31
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 Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 2:45 am
Post subject: Wrong ruling? |
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I was playing in a comp at G casino tonight and this happended.
2 people folded, I was next to act and I min raised to 1200, guy on my left called. Just as he called the guy utg raised to 2200 (none of us had realised the other 2 had folded out of turn). Dealer called for a ruling.
Ruling given was that the guy utg who'd tried to raise to 2200 had to take his chips back and put 1200 in. |
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knifeboy62
Full House
Joined: 05 Nov 2006
Posts: 1430
Location: Bristol
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Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:26 am
Post subject: Re: Wrong ruling? |
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Doesn't sound right to me at all. UTG should be allowed to bet 2200 and you and other player can opt to do any of fold/call/raise as there has been substantial change in the action once UTG has bet.
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PokerWolf1
Full House
Joined: 23 Jan 2012
Posts: 996
Location: Wolverhampton
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Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 11:49 am
Post subject: Re: Wrong ruling? |
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| knifeboy62 wrote: | | Doesn't sound right to me at all. UTG should be allowed to bet 2200 and you and other player can opt to do any of fold/call/raise as there has been substantial change in the action once UTG has bet. |
This.
Haven't got the link to the rule but Im sure EPT ruling states that if someone raises out of turn (yourself in this case) that bet would stand unless someone who was supposed to act before you raises after the mistake was made(utg in this case). This then gives the option for the out of turn raiser to take their chips back and call, raise or fold based on the utg bet.
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bigc82
Trips
Joined: 31 Jul 2011
Posts: 149
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Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 12:45 pm
Post subject: Re: Wrong ruling? |
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| 4 players have acted before the UTG pipes up, in my opinion his hand is folded. |
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_doubleup
Flush
Joined: 15 Apr 2005
Posts: 591
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Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 3:07 pm
Post subject: Re: Wrong ruling? |
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| bigc82 wrote: | | 4 players have acted before the UTG pipes up, in my opinion his hand is folded. |
this is correct, his hand is dead, simplest ever ruling, any TD not getting this right should be sacked. |
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PokerWolf1
Full House
Joined: 23 Jan 2012
Posts: 996
Location: Wolverhampton
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Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2012 8:18 pm
Post subject: Re: Wrong ruling? |
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| _doubleup wrote: | | bigc82 wrote: | | 4 players have acted before the UTG pipes up, in my opinion his hand is folded. |
this is correct, his hand is dead, simplest ever ruling, any TD not getting this right should be sacked. |
UTG isn't always the easiest position to play from. Could of been a short stack thinking about making a move. We don't know wether he was counting his stack / how long it took for the others to fold as it could of been instant as soon as it was dealt out etc UTG hand is not dead just because someone else wasn't paying attention. That ruling could even lead to future angle shooting is someone was either a very big stack or very short stack utg.
Dealer mistake for not noticing it as well imo.
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bigc82
Trips
Joined: 31 Jul 2011
Posts: 149
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Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 10:30 am
Post subject: Re: Wrong ruling? |
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Well I would also have given UTG+1 a warning for acting out of turn and a penalty for a repeat offence. Its normally pretty easy to spot the guy to your left folding (unless your in seat  so all you need to do is say stop ive not acted yet. |
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Joe The Elegance Beevers
Mobster
Joined: 18 Sep 2003
Posts: 1872
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Posted: Sun Jul 01, 2012 1:19 pm
Post subject: Re: Wrong ruling? |
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| bigc82 wrote: | | 4 players have acted before the UTG pipes up, in my opinion his hand is folded. |
It all depends on context. If UTGs hand was clearly visble and he had very little time to speak up as it all happened simultaneously and he spoke up at the first available opportunity I might bring the action back - he does after all have the right to act on his hand. If action is brought back all actions would be available to him. If he checked the other action behind him would stand, if he didn't check it would not.
If the other action was significant and the UTG had had ample time to speak but didn't then it may be ruled that his hand is dead.
I much prefer the first option if at all possible.
Forcing the UTG to put exactly 1200 in the pot would not be a ruling that I could make.
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