FTP deal expected to be closed next week

[Mikee]

[oneshotbob]

Why do they have to pay them back? Tapie was nothing to do with the original FT. It's not his scam. Why would he pick up the pieces, costing him $185m?

Like I said, I hope I'm wrong. But all I can see is a lot fo people who are hoping they'll get their money, wishing it to be so.
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@oneshotbobby on twitter

[Koumari Boy]

The reason he has to pay the rest of the world players their balances is because part of the deal for him getting the assets of Full Tilt from the DoJ in America is that he assumes responsibility for making the Rest of The World players whole....whatever that may mean.

He pays the DoJ $80 million in exchange for the assets of Full Tilt and a responsibility for the RoW player balances.

Other than that he would have no legal responsibility for paying them back as he didnt steal any of the player money...the old Full Tilt board/directors/shareholders did.
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Wish I could Find The Time To Play More Poker:-(

[_doubleup]

[Koumari Boy]

[iTerror]

Tapie/his lawyers have already stated that they intend to keep the Full Tilt brand. If they just wanted the software and player base details then they wouldn't have spent this long trying to do a deal. They want Full Tilt as the brand to promote, that is clear.

Now if he wasn't to back the money people are owed, it'd be the most flawed business plan I've ever seen; and I've seen a few in my time as I'm a boring old accountant. The brand would get flamed from every corner of the community. It'd be forever tarnished even with new management and I'm sure a LOT of people would hold a strong grudge against it.

If Full Tilt wants to prosper again then it'll have to fulfill a commitment to players money outside the states. It was a money-making machine and it will be again if everything goes through with the deal.

It's my opinion that the deal will get done. I believe the money owed will be honoured except i believe some tactics will be used to make sure it's not a mass withdrawal job which would need huge cashflow of course.

[Koumari Boy]

[dwh103]

Would be surprised if full balances were honoured. Think it's more likely that a % will be returned with the rest of it being in the form of a bonus with generous conditions to work it off.

Stars did this once taking on the player balances of a now defunct site. Can't remember the name though.
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My blog: http://thepokerlifeofdave.blogspot.com/

[Alex B]

People thought a proven ownership super-user scandal would prevent people playing at Absolute/UB, but it wasn't the case.

Lets say Tapie has the option, and doesn't cover Lederer and co's debt. How many pros who lost money are going to avoid a site which will be super-soft without them there, because of a principle based on different people from a different company having robbed them?
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http://www.alexbowler.com

[JAKE900]

What does GBT need to do ? that seems to be the base of the discussion, many people firmly believe they need to repay all the players and other believe they simply dont.

before FTP stopped they were roughly 3 times the size (bit more) of Ipoker or party poker who are about the same as eachother (www.pokerscout.com)

we know the deal cost and can make a very rough estimate of the restart costs. So we can also determine how much custom FTP would need to return to make them profitable.

for them to restart profitably they need to have a total amount of players either return or reactivate or new influx of players totalling half of Ipokers current player base.

so roughly 1/6th of their previous 7 day average.

if this were to happen then they would be profitable over a two year stretch.

so we also then have to ask ourselves. how many poker players read the internet boards such as this one. the known answer for that is less than 10%

for years everyone said that internet poker is rigged (and in one notable case they were right) but people still played.
for years everyone knew that most of the main sites were operating illegally but people still played.

and as Harry accurately points out, what does 'make whole' mean ?
If the US does end up regarding FTP as a ponzi then only deposits will be returned not balances.

Is GBT in any way liable for past owners mistakes,, nope, not at all.

so it boils down to a very simple, what do they need to do to make a profit on the $185m reported cost ?

FTP however has some major differences between a reopen now and their factors then.

the US market which accounted for roughly 60% of their player base is now closed. so they would be restarting in a very competitive euro / ROW market. poker stars who dominate these markets and have a long and successful history of directly competing with other sites will very certainly make large attempts to combat any relaunch of FTP .
(let us not forget when FTP had its last major festival PS put up monster Sunday million guarantee and caused pain to FTP's FTOP ME)

we also, to this point have only been told things, we have not seen paperwork detailing how and when ROW players will be repaid who s to say the new FTP wont repay the players 6 months after the relaunch. i mean it would be a reasonable business plan to make players regain a loyalty tier or have a play through on the release of funds.

yes that last suggestion would get negative feedback but it would work and be effective.

what about if they slow released say 10% of everyones money each month. so there is never a full amount to cash out and most people get small playable chunks. that would work also.

what from my point of view i certainly dont see is GBT releasing one large chunk of money to players that almost certainly will never hit the felt to be played. they do not have to do this and it would be a waste of more than 100million if they did. no company ever with this long to plan has ever done that.

now for the optimistic argument: what happens if they do give everyone an opening balance as it was on midnight 14th April last year ?

yes people will cash out, yes people will then trust and play FTP and it will be strong. but can GBT know this, can they make a business plan based on the simple premise of, we pay out 100million+ and people will come back.

yes they probably will. BUT there are other methods tens of millions cheaper

[iTerror]

[Koumari Boy]

Thankfully if the deal is confirmed soon we will not have to wait long to see what reimbursement proposals if any will follow.

On a side issue wonder what litigation could be taken against the old FTP board and owners amd possibly even the DoJ if players cant have all their money on any reopening or if they are made to suffer any shortfalls?
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Wish I could Find The Time To Play More Poker:-(

[Koumari Boy]

[darrensprengers]

the doj may have some provisos before giving him the money. i doubt people will get 1 for 1 back but between .5 to .7 to 1 seems a probablity
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The next best thing to gambling and winning is gambling and losing.

-- Nick "The Greek" Dandalos

[JAKE900]

the ISPT is basically a non event that is for sure.

the way it set up and everything involved. it simply wont happen.

that many people can be done inside Wembley. but to have perfect connection at all times on 30k notepads/ ipads / laptops is a no.

the 30% in first place is a no, as in all the other places are made so small that it isnt viable. i mean, the WSOP main has 6.5k runners and pays 15% to first.

the time frame put forward for the booking of Wembley isnt viable (and you cant extend or play late on any day as Wembley has limits on its use).

the state, placement and operation of the stand at ICE this year for ISPT was ridiculous.

ISPT will, as i have said before be the holding company for the new FTP and ISPT is 70% owned by Ray Bitar and co. (GBT having 30%).

As such ISPT has been set up and given all the required front and activity of a real company but in the end it simply wont happen as advertised. this leaves a company shell, which is then a holdign company and you can all join the dots