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Joined: 24 Sep 2011
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 9:31 pm
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Wish I had watched it before posting what I said before. Don't think it was nearly as bad as people made out earlier. I had visions of him agreeing a deal with everyone, shaking hands and them all celebrating with their rails, patting backs etc. But it was nothing like that.

Not only would I not use the word scummy, I don't think he actually did anything wrong. Some people might not like it, but I don't think he did anything morally wrong, never mind not breaking any rules etc. They were discussing a deal, he said no to the first deal proposed, told them the minimum he would need to do a deal, which 2 of the others agreed to, and the other took ages to think about. While the itallian went to his rail to discuss it first, Tom went to his, and they basically offered him a better deal. They guraranteed what he wanted as a mimimum, and took the gamble themselves that he would go on to win more.

To be fair, the deal as it stood wasn't that great for him. He needed to go on to win the event, to get even close to 2nd place prize Money. And doing a deal, that all 4 people are going to be happy with, is going to be very difficult. I see what people are saying, that he shouldn't get advice, but the itallian got advice, and it seems his friends said to take it, but at the same time Toms backers said something else, so it Works both ways.

I guess to some people, Tom's backers taking the risk and guaranteeing Tom's share seems a bit off, but it is the real world, and these things happen. So I think its good that its all done on camera, and not off camera and have the organisers claim that no deals are done.

If I was the organiser, I would have the players discuss it for 5 mins, then go to the rail to discuss with backers Family friends etc, then they have 5 minutes to agree or not, no deal back to poker.

I really don't think Tom offered a deal, then went back on it. There was a deal suggested, he said he didn't like it, and he explained why, and said what he would need. Some agreed but not everyone, and by the time everyone did agree, he had changed his mind. If the Italian was able to say no, but change his mind after speaking to his corner, it seems only fair, that Tom or any of the others can change their mind to say no after initially saying yes.

I would say this is the online equivalent of agreeing to deal by clicking the box, but not actually wanting to accept the ICM numbers and the others not agreeing to the share you want. Maybe some don't like it, especially the part with the backers, but I am 100% certain this has happened many times before in other tournaments, here we just got to see everything, and for me, thats better.
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Joined: 09 Nov 2009
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Location: Wales

PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:29 pm
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I don't think Tom does much wrong here to be honest. (And its all been said before - see Daniels post.)

The Key point for me was that 1 player agreed to the deal very quickly and the backers/rail clearly thought Tom could exploit this 'weakness' as he was to his immediate left thus ensuring a higher amount.

From a money and winning strategy perspective this was probably the correct thing to do.

I don't know Tom but sometimes you need to be told to go for the monster win when the sensible head is saying take the money.
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Joined: 18 Jan 2006
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2014 11:45 pm
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After watching the link, I agree 100% with Daniel. Also, I'm not sure of this and I'm not sure if it's still the case, but these were Tom's long-term backers (guys that stake him to play online and whom he could have been in shedloads of make-up with). There is a difference between this set-up and guys that just buy some action for a one-off tourney imo. They're effectively his bosses and pull the strings on a number of things, one of which includes whether to accept certain deals or not.
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