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Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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SeanFoley
Quads


Joined: 23 Oct 2008
Posts: 1677
Location: Birmingham

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 8:11 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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Lol, nice one, you were just as good Very Happy Welcome all the same!
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Raf White
Genting Poker Manager


Joined: 22 Mar 2012
Posts: 100

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 8:13 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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SeanFoley wrote:
Lol, nice one, you were just as good Very Happy Welcome all the same!

Thanks
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Tomssss
One Pair


Joined: 01 Sep 2011
Posts: 23

PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 8:29 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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Thanks for your answer Raf but there was one mistake. We never decided who won because once one of the queens touched the muck they ruled his hand dead and we were not able to see the flop turn and river. That should not change your answer much if at all I am guessing.
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Raf White
Genting Poker Manager


Joined: 22 Mar 2012
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 8:35 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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Tomssss wrote:
Thanks for your answer Raf but there was one mistake. We never decided who won because once one of the queens touched the muck they ruled his hand dead and we were not able to see the flop turn and river. That should not change your answer much if at all I am guessing.


Well no, because in that instance then

Genting Rule - 11. Face Up for All-Ins
All cards will be turned face up once a player is all-in and all betting action is complete.


The cards have to be tabled face up and this is the dealer's responsibility.

The hand should have been ran out and the pot awarded accordingly.

The one card touched the muck is still utterly laughable and a complete joke.

I'm intrigued as to where this happened, if you don't want to publicly name and shame them then could you please pm me just for my own professional curiosity.
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Jon MW
The British Cowboy


Joined: 17 Feb 2006
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 9:07 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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Raf - Genting wrote:
...
The one card touched the muck is still utterly laughable and a complete joke.

I'm intrigued as to where this happened, if you don't want to publicly name and shame them then could you please pm me just for my own professional curiosity.


I don't know where the OP was playing but that was exactly what the Rendezvous Brighton said in the tournament I played there a few weeks ago.

tbh I was pretty gobsmacked that anywhere still had the idea that the 'magical muck' would kill a hand by itself.

I told the floor person who made the ruling they were wrong and he called the card room manager - he reversed the decision, but not because it was obviously stupid - but because the dealer said that he thought my cards touched the deck rather than the muck
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The Reverend
In Rhythm


Joined: 27 Aug 2004
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 10:19 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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The Qs were face up when they happened to touch a mucked card? Awful decision if so.
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pokerwaldorf
Genting Poker Manager


Joined: 16 Feb 2010
Posts: 955
Location: Genting

PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:48 am
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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The Reverend wrote:
The Qs were face up when they happened to touch a mucked card? Awful decision if so.


Yes, he turned them face up and at first they did not touch the muck, it was only when they were slide forward a bit by the player so Tomsss could see them (seats 1 and 10) that his oppo accidentally slide them a shade too far so they touched the muck.

They were turned face up onto the muck, or lobbed in specatuar fashion over the line and landed slightly on the muck....nothing ambiguous, just a genuine mistake with absolutely no opportunity to angle shoot.
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Sink Me
Two Pair


Joined: 17 Jul 2009
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 1:28 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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A desperately bad ruling and an excellent reply from Raf backed up by some very good Genting rules.

Tomssss, I would ask the poker room staff concerned to have a good look at this thread and try to learn something (and maybe get a copy of the Genting rules Mr. Green )
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Tomssss
One Pair


Joined: 01 Sep 2011
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 2:53 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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I have no trouble mentioning the casino but I doubt that any of the people would ever get there, lol. It is one of a series of small casinos run by the Canadian government. It is called the Port Edward casino and the tournament series was called the Blue Water classic. I did try to discuss it with the TD yesterday but was told that a rule is a rule and that he was not allowed to make any other decision. The circumstances were irrelevant as far as he was concerned. He said he had no interest in discussing it any more and he walked away. When I approached his boss he told me that he was not willing to discuss it either and if I did not like it he would refund my money for the final two tournaments. I accepted and did not play but since there was a long waiting list for both tournaments it did not cost them anything.

I checked with another TD at one of the other casinos managed by the same people and he said that there is no way he would have ruled the same way and that the decision was a joke. The Port Edward casino is famous(I found out) for doing everything in their power to make sure local people get all the breaks. Why I was getting the break in this case I don’t know but I am only looking for a fair game for all so I still don’t like it.

In retrospect I should have accepted the chips after voicing my displeasure and continued playing. I could then have cut the other party for a share. It was just that the TD was being such a Sh** head that I sort of lost it. I never raised my voice though and tried to appeal to logic but he just kept getting more and more belligerent. It was not a lot of money in the pool however and I play for fun. His attitude ruined any fun I would have had going forward so went he threatened to disqualify me I told him it still wasn’t right. He even gave me a count down to accepting the chips(like someone calling time)which I found hilarious.

Thanks everyone for the responses.
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stowjon
Royal Flush


Joined: 26 Oct 2008
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 3:08 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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Tomssss wrote:
. It is one of a series of small casinos run by the Canadian government. It is called the Port Edward casino


Now it all makes sense it was in the nation that are the most unlucky in the world! 1/2 french 1/2 American it just the worst beat in the world!
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Tomssss
One Pair


Joined: 01 Sep 2011
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 6:48 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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Lol, using your logic I would think everyone in England is Indian. I did a project in a small town in England and there was one fast food outland, one pub and 6 Indian restaurants. I think we have just about exhausted my outrage over this. Thanks for the responses.
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Barny
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Joined: 18 Sep 2003
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 7:00 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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I can't think offhand think of a more badly handled situation by any TD ever.
We are seriously considering inviting this TD onto the next YATTD panel as the borderline insane have been underrepresented since we lost Marty and Liam.
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Raf White
Genting Poker Manager


Joined: 22 Mar 2012
Posts: 100

PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 9:51 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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Barny, I'll see you next week at The Fox

Last edited by Raf White on Sat Mar 24, 2012 12:53 am; edited 1 time in total
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stowjon
Royal Flush


Joined: 26 Oct 2008
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Location: willingham

PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:35 pm
Post subject: Re: Was I wrong (or why are all TD's ****)
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Raf - Genting wrote:
Barny wrote:
I can't think offhand think of a more badly handled situation by any TD ever.


At least you can be sure of nothing like this happening at the GPS, see you next week at The Fox


why did you have to go and say that! Naughty
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